“I disagree with your comment about Ree being the only attractive character in the film. Her friend is not unattractive and her siblings are adorable. Satterfield played by Tate Taylor is quite good looking and even Teardrop’s wife is pretty.”

Okay, maybe instead of saying the “only” attractive character, I should have said the “most” attractive character. I mean, I doubt Tate Taylor looks nearly this good in a bikini: http://filmdrunk.uproxx.com/?attachment_id=29278

“Hey, I think you should use your hillbilly dialog and write the sequel!”

I have an idea for the sequel. Ree gives up her dream of joining the army and supports the family as a swimsuit model instead.

But I’d also like to continue to re-write the original. I wonder what Sheriff Baskin does with those hands:

Sheriff Baskin: Hey, jist wanna let y’all know that Jessup ain’t agonna be a-showin’ up in court.

DA: Why not?

Sheriff Baskin: Well, seems he went and got his self killed. He is currently deceased…as in day-ed.

DA: Murdered?

Sheriff Baskin: Sho’nuff looks that way.

DA: Have you established the corpus delicti?

Sheriff Baskin: The hell you say? We dern’t use them fancy pantsy words around har.

DA: The body, Mr. Baskin? Have you found the body?

Sheriff Baskin: Well…yes and no.

DA: The hell you say?

Sheriff Baskin: We was able to eee-stablish the whereabouts of his…haynds.

DA: Did he have a wood chipper accident or something, Mr. Baskin?

Sheriff Baskin: I reckon more like a chainsaw accident.

DA: Mr. Baskin, how did you happen to come by Mr. Dolly’s hands?

Sheriff Baskin: Well, that thar’s a funny story. Do ya know Jessup’s daughter, Ree? Real purdy child.

DA: No, Mr. Baskin, I don’t know her. What does she have to do with this?

Sheriff Baskin: Well, th’other day she come ta th’office, and damned if she dern’t just drop them durn old haynds right smack on my desk. I mean, if that don’t beat all.

DA: And Mr. Baskin, if I may ask, how did Mr. Dolly’s daughter happen to come into the possession of her father’s hands?

Sheriff Baskin: That thar’s a durn fine question. I were a-ponderin’ on that my own self.

DA: Did you…ask her, Mr. Baskin?

[The DA’s question is met with utter silence]

DA: Mr. Baskin, are you there?

Sheriff Baskin: s’pose I jist plum forgot.

DA: I see. Do you have any leads? Any suspects?

Sheriff Baskin: No, I sho’ don’t.

DA: Mr. Baskin, who do you suppose might have had a motive to kill Mr. Dolly?

Sheriff Baskin: Well, now, that thar’s a tough one. Reckon it could be a whole heap of people.

DA: Mr. Baskin, it has been established, has it not, that Mr. Dolly was attempting to get a lesser sentence in exchange for information on … Mr. Thump Milton – AKA “Thumper”?

Sheriff Baskin: Yesir, that is the truth, sho’ nuff is. ‘cept I wouldn’t call him Thumper if’n I was you.

DA: Well, Mr. Baskin, I’m no detective, but it seems to me that you have your prime suspect right there: Thump Milton. I don’t suppose he took too kindly to Jessup’s snitching.

Sheriff Baskin: I declare, that thars some mighty fine deducin’.

DA: Thank you, Mr. Baskin. And isn’t it also true that the value of Mr. Dolly’s house was not enough to cover the cost of bail and that the remainder was paid in cash by somebody? Any idea who that somebody might be, Mr. Baskin?

Sheriff Baskin [scratching head]: No, no, caint rightly say I do. Ya sho’ got me there.

DA: Mr. Baskin, who do you think might have had the means and the motive to spring Mr. Dolly?

Sheriff Baskin: Why, of course! Thump Milton!

DA: I don’t want to tell you how to conduct your business, Mr. Baskin, but don’t you think it might be a good idea to question the bail bondsman? If anyone knows who put down that cash it would be him.

Sheriff Baskin: Damn good idear.

DA: Mr. Baskin, what kind of tests have you run on the hands?

Sheriff Baskin [flustered]: I resent your implication that I’m a stupid local yokel corrupt sheriff in Thumper’s pocket! Er, I mean, Mr. Milton.

DA: Mr. Baskin, I am implying nothing of the sort. You seem to be overreacting just a tad. I’m merely trying to get some information. So, I’ll ask again: what kind of tests have you run on the hands? Did you run the fingerprints?

Sheriff Baskin: We sho’ did. Them fingerprints match Jessup’s. Looky Hyeer, rest assured that those thar haynds have been tested every which way.

DA: Have you run any tests on the hands that might indicate where the body was dumped. If it was dumped in, say, one of the local swamps, there should be evidence of that on the hands.

[Complete silence again]

DA: Mr. Baskin, I know you can hear me. I’m going to assume your silence means you have not done any further testing.

Sheriff Baskin: Any other questions, Mr. Smarty Pants?

DA: You mentioned that the hands were, ahem, removed with a chainsaw.

Sheriff Baskin: Yesir.

DA: Well, Mr. Baskin…?

Sheriff Baskin: Well, what, sir?

DA: Again, I’m no detective, but if the Miltons used a chainsaw to cut off Mr. Jessup’s hands, it stands to reason that the chainsaw just might contain some incriminating evidence. So, maybe the first thing you should do is get a search warrant and see if you can’t locate that chainsaw on the Miltons’ property.

Sheriff Baskin: You are good. I’ll give ya that. I’m on it, sir.

Apparently the Miltons didn’t really think this through, because by helping Ree they’re putting themselves in serious jeopardy. I think it’s fair to say that this matter would not just go away. In order to prove those hands are Jessup’s, an identification of the hands will have to be determined, reports will have to be written, tests will have to be conducted. Once a positive ID has been made, and it becomes obvious that Jessup won’t be turning up in court, lawyers will have to be contacted, the bail bondsman will have to be told, courts will have to be notified. Questions will be asked. In other words, a lot of outsiders, possibly including the Feds, will get wind of the murder, which is the last thing the Miltons would want.

I caint stop a-thinkin’ ’bout this har film. Here’s some more stuff to chew on:

You ask, “where was the bother?”

What I meant when I asked, “why bother” (referring to the beating), is what, really, does it accomplish? In an earlier post you said, “Teardrop had brought Ree from roadhouse to roadhouse, so that everyone could see how severely Ree had been beaten.” I’m not exactly sure what your point is, but it seems to suggest that the severity of Ree’s beating will meet with the “disapproval” of the locals and get them talking. You also say the Miltons were riled by Ree’s effrontery by not heeding their warnings, and that they beat her because she wasn’t respecting the Ozark ways. Is it the “Ozark ways” for clans to beat up defenseless female trespassers and/or violators of the code of silence? If so, then she just got what she deserved and the Miltons should not have to worry about any “talk” among the neighbors. That’s just their way, after all.

On the other hand, if beating up defenseless female trespassers and/or violators of the code of silence is not the “Ozark way”, then why do it? In this case, the only thing the beating really accomplishes is drawing unnecessary attention to what cretins they are and needlessly provoking the volatile Teardrop. All they have to do is run her off their property; the beating is gratuitous.

I submit that the real motivation behind the beating is to intimidate her into ending her search for the body, because the Miltons fear that her snooping might bring the murder to light. This is why they are truly riled; not so much because she’s not respecting the Ozark ways. But even in this case the beating is a blunder. No matter how much snooping she does, it’s unlikely she’ll ever find out what happened or where the body is – unless they, ya know, show her.

You say, “It would make more sense for Merab to simply deliver Jessup’s hands to Ree.”

I agree : )

You say, “however, I got the sense that Ree was undergoing a rite of initiation into the Ozark ways”

Must the Miltons adhere so damn strictly to that code? I would think that sometimes, just sometimes mind you, it might be in their own self-interest not to adhere so firmly to the “Ozark ways.” I think this just may be one of those times.

By taking Ree to the body and delivering her the hands, not only have they established that a murder took place, they’ve also shown the Dolly family exactly where the body is buried.

Taking her to the body is sheer idiocy from a logical standpoint. Her promise to adhere to the Ozark code of silence was offered under duress. They can’t be certain she (or Teardrop) would never talk.

But it’s not so much Ree the Miltons have to worry about after delivering Jessup’s hands to her. It’s the authorities they have to worry about after Ree delivers Jessup’s hands to the sheriff’s office! Not to mention Teardop, who now has that “actionable information” you spoke about.

Mat

One comment I forgot to make above:

You say, “By the way, this is a pretty standard film noir element: a detective asks too many questions, and gets a beating for his troubles.”

Yeah, I’ve seen some refer to Winter’s Bone as “country noir.” But good noir, real noir, retains its bleak worldview all the way to the bitter end. It doesn’t go soft. It doesn’t pull back and offer the audience cozy, reassuring messages about the “indomitability of the human spirit” or the “human capacity for goodness” like Winter’s Bone does. And the protagonists in real noir aren’t used as symbols of purity the way Ree is.

Mat

Check out this clip from a Q&A session with Granik. An audience member asks her how she reconciles the film’s violence and unpleasantness with its sentimentality and romanticism. Here’s what Granik says about Merab: “…she does the right thing ultimately. She does have a conscience. She’s able to be reflexive about her behavior. That final plea gets under her skin. She uses violence and threatening behavior, and in the end - goodness - she had the humanity to be able to see someone in their naked plea and do something about it.”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpQDFmmRVi4&feature=player_embedded

Notice the words and phrases she uses: Merab “does the right thing”. She has “goodness”. She has “humanity”. Granik’s comments would seem to validate my contention that the Miltons, in the end, act more out of compassion than self-interest. After hearing Ree’s impassioned plea, they take pity on her. They admire her pluck, respect her promised adherence to the Ozark code, and empathize with her situation. Ree reawakens their “humanity” and they “do the right thing”, despite the risks involved.

Around the time of the beating, the film’s contrived humanism comes to the fore. Granik wants to have it both ways: to rub our noses in hillbilly despair and to lift our spirits with comforting notions of human goodness. For most of the film Ree stands in stark contrast to the rest of the community. She seems to have sprung from a different world entirely. As a virtually ethereal being among the dregs, she stands above the rest, both physically (she’s the only attractive character in the film) and morally, functioning not as a plausibly drawn character in her own right but as the embodiment of an abstract idea: that of the capacity for human goodness. She is the one pure being among all the trash and scum who seemingly lost their humanity long ago. However, Ree’s goodness begins to rub off on others after a while. She is the moral center of the Ozarkian universe, around whom every other character eventually revolves. We see this first in the occasional charitable gesture: one neighbor gives her food and clothing, another one loans her a truck. Later, the bail bondsman gives her the leftover cash out of the goodness of his heart. And, of course, Teardrop risks his life to protect her and achieves a sort of redemption . By the end, Ree has become the recipient of some truly astonishing acts of altruism, climaxing with the Miltons’ errand of mercy. Yes, just when things look bleakest, hillbilly humanity asserts itself.

In an earlier post you argued that “we ought to assume that the Miltons were motivated purely out of perceived self-interest.” I would argue that the Miltons have far more to lose than to gain by helping her. From the standpoint of pure self-interest, helping Ree is downright foolish – especially after she promises to adhere to the Ozark code of silence. Allowing Ree to drop her father’s decaying hands off at the sheriff’s office offers incontrovertible proof that a murder has taken place, which will only increase the likelihood of what the Miltons have been trying to avoid the entire film: bringing the law down upon them.

That the sheriff informs Thump about Jessup’s snitching implies that he (the sheriff) might be on the take. He is, perhaps, as dependent on the local meth economy as the others. However, it does not necessarily follow that Thump is not afraid of the law, as you apparently agree. After all, we know that some sort of crackdown has taken place; otherwise Jessup would not have been arrested. Further, dealing meth is a federal offense, and although Thump might not be all that concerned about a local, small-time sheriff in his pocket, he might very well be concerned about a crackdown by the Feds. News of a murder connected with the local meth operations would only draw unwanted attention from “outsiders” – not locals. The last thing the Miltons want is outsiders meddling in local affairs.

Moreover, helping Ree will make it more likely, not less, that the one local they have reason to fear, Teardrop (more on this below), will be provoked to seek revenge against them, because now Teardrop knows without a shadow of a doubt that his brother Jessup was murdered, and by whom. If the body is never discovered there always remains open the possibility that Jessup simply skipped bail and fled the area, and Teardrop would not be duty bound to avenge his brother’s murder.

All of which is why, for me, the denouement travels about as far into the realm of “fetchedness” as a story can go. This concluding errand of mercy is merely symptomatic of Granik’s attempts to wrest false optimism out of the despairing bleakness. That the Miltons would risk arrest and the wrath of Teardrop just to help a girl they barely know simply stretches credulity to the snapping point. No, I’m afraid the clan’s sudden about face has more to do with contrived plot mechanics and Granik’s need to overlay soothing notions about the the capacity for human goodness on the bleak material than it does with plausible character motivation.

You say, “I’m not sure that the Miltons do fear Ree.”

Her snooping could bring the murder to light. That’s why they fear her. My assumption is that the thrashing is intended to intimidate her into keeping quiet and to ensure that she stops snooping around. Are you telling me that they’re more concerned that “she may not respect the Ozark ways” than that her snooping might bring the law down on them?

You say, “the Miltons fear Teardrop because he is a man with a history of violence, who is capable of being ruthless and brutal. Given his meth habit, Teardrop is both unstable and unpredictable.”

But he’s only one man. The Miltons, on the other hand, are the most feared and powerful clan in the territory - the primary enforcer within the underground meth economy.

You say, “The key is that Teardrop needs actionable information in order to get revenge for Jessup’s killing.”

Precisely. And the Miltons give it to him on a platter by taking Ree to the body. Before they decided to help Ree there was no definitive proof that a murder actually occurred, and hence no “actionable information in order to get revenge for Jessup’s killing.” More proof that the Miltons acted more out of compassion than self-interest.

Thanks for the info on Teardrop’s tattoo. I had never heard about that before, nor did I even notice the tattoo below his eye! I have to say that Teardrop is, by far, my favorite character in the film. Nevertheless, I still maintain that there’s a certain sentimentality built into the character which betrays Granik’s tendency to soften the film’s otherwise despairing vision. That he would come to Ree’s aid is plausible, I suppose; she’s kin, after all. But as the film progresses Teardrop continues to undergo a discernible softening; before long the film seems on the brink of becoming a backwoods tearjerker. By the end, Teardrop’s latent tears have nearly been brought to the surface. Granik, however, is too restrained, too “tasteful” a filmmaker to resort to anything as melodramatic as unleashing Teardrop’s pent-up waterworks. So, he strums the banjo instead.

Mat

It is certainly possible, even likely, the Merab and Thump had some feelings of sympathy for Ree, and the plight of her family. And Ree’s plea was impressive. The fact that Thump relented to even hear Ree out seems to me to imply that Thump at least respected the courage that Ree displayed in being willing to take the beating.

Yet, even after that, the Miltons were in no hurry to solve Ree’s problem. Merab waited until the last possible day to take Ree to the pond. It would have been compassionate for them to solve Ree’s problem soon after the beating, but I don’t see how it would have served the Miltons’ interests to give Ree Jessup’s hands straightaway.

My take on the character of Teardrop is the following:
He “earned” his nickname because he killed somebody. He has been on the wrong side of the law for most of his life. He has served stints in jail. He has been shot.
In the prison culture, derived, I believe from gang culture, somebody will tattoo a “teardrop”, just under the eye. Uncle Teardrop appears to have such a marking under his Left eye. The virtue of this explanation is that the Teardrop moniker again becomes apt, and there is no need for the film viewer to assume that assume that the Hawkes character has had some sort of transforming epiphanhy into some softy. It was done in a low-key way, but Teardrop unambiguously told Ree that he knew which of the Milton clan had killed Jessup, and tacitly told Ree that he was going off to try to kill Jessup’s killers….

Teardrop is no softie: He brings the two chicks to Ashlee and Sonny, and indeed strums the banjo. It is a gesture of farewell, which lasts all of maybe 15 minutes. His essential character is unchanged, and in my opinion, is more bad than good. However, as the film is directed, I believe that the aim is to achieve a sort of balance: To avoid stereotypical portrayals (while mainaining a sense of realism), and to avoid monolithic characterizations, so that even an essentially bad or hard nature still can exhibit moments of kindness or sentiment, and still have the capacity to surprise the audience. But given that the film ends with Teardrop going off to kill, and probably die in the attempt, I would deem Winter’s Bone ending to be particularly optimistic.

As for Thump and Merab Milton, I think that they are human, and have no need to be “humanized”. I didn’t get the notion that the Miltons would have enjoyed killing Jessup. It was cruel to kill him, perhaps, but they found out he was a snitch, and they did what they do to snitches. Again, if we were to render a judgment, the Miltons could be seen as essentially bad (in that they are responsible for hurting, even killing a whole bunch of people–Merab seems to quite handy with a chainsaw and corpses). However, they are not monolithically evil, nor simplistic in their motivations.

You pose interesting questions, and I’ll see if there is a way to reconcile our respective postions!

“If the sheriff is in Thump’s pocket, why would the Miltons have any fear of a snooping 17-year-old girl?”

I’m not sure that the Miltons do fear Ree. They obviously have fears that Ree might not react appropriately, IF she were given the means to complete her quest. That is, once she found Jessup’s body, she may then do something stupid, like attempt to bring the perpetrators to justice.

Her snooping is an affront, and indication that she is out of line, and that she may not respect the Ozark ways. This which riles them, and ultimately becomes a serious nuisance, but I’m not sure that fear is ever their primary motivation.

“Why would they bother to beat her up? Why not just continue to ignore her until she goes away?”

Where was the bother? Ree delivered herself to the Miltons; Merab knew Ree was climbing up the hill, and had ample time to summon her sisters.

Even after Ree had stalked Thump at the Cattle Auction, if she had just stayed away from Thump and Merab’s farm, the Milton’s probably would not have gone to the hassle of hunting her down, just to beat her up.

But Ree went back to the Miltons, trespassed, and ignored Merab’s warning. Since Ree didn’t heed the verbal warning to drop the snooping, it was only logical for them to up the ante, and try to intimidate her with a beating. By the way, this is a pretty standard film noir element: a detective asks too many questions, and gets a beating for his troubles.

“Because there might be “talk” among the neighbors? Because the Miltons would “lose face”?

If they allowed Ree to continue to stalk Thump in public, and harrass them on their own land, I think that both of those factors would provide ample motivation.

“Better yet, if the Miltons have nothing to fear from the law, why not just saw his hands off sooner and be done with it? Why bother with all the threatening and beating?”

It’s not that the Miltons have nothing to fear from the law. I never made that claim. Having Sherriff Baskin in their pocket is a nice Trump card, but that doesn’t mean that they do not have anything to fear from the law. Certainly, their meth operation has already come under scrutiny, thanks to Jessup’s snitching.

No doubt, there are other law enforment authorities who have not been bought off. If the pressure to solve the case becomes too great, even Baskin might not be reliable. The point is that the Miltons probably feel that they can take a calculated risk to allow Ree to have Jessup’s hands, and that doing so might have several benefits to which I’ve previously alluded: That Ree would be mollified (this happened), that “the talk” would die down (which was likely to happen), and that they would not be punishing the rest of the Dolly family (which probably was not their intention, and may even go against the Ozark mores).

It would make more sense for Merab to simply deliver Jessup’s hands to Ree. However, I got the sense that Ree was undergoing a rite of initiation into the Ozark ways, and that she had to prove herself doubly because she was a Woman, and because she was young (still a child, really). The dignity (if that is the right word) in which she endured the beating, and her subsequent speech to Thump, which touched all of the right notes, probably went a long way into convincing them thatRee could be trusted. That, and the fact that Teardrop “stood for” Ree, and was willing to “answer for” any indiscretions on the part of Ree.

Cutting the hands off of Jessup’s corpse was no doubt a deep unpleasant prospect, even for Merab. Given that, while it might not have been strictly logical for Merab to take the (rather modest) additional risk of showing Ree where the body was dumped, it was certainly understandable. And both Thump and Merab had to be convinced that Ree would never talk, if they were ever, under any circumstances, to allow Ree to have Jessup’s hands.

“Why would the Miltons fear a loner like Teardrop (his “clan” apparently consists of a wife, three young nieces and nephews, and an incapacitated sister-in-law), especially when he clearly demonstrates a reluctance to get involved at all initially?”

The Miltons fear Teardrop because he is a man with a history of violence, who is capable of being ruthless and brutal. Given his meth habit, Teardrop is both unstable and unpredictable.

The key is that Teardrop needs actionable information in order to get revenge for Jessup’s killing. It is not so much that he is reluctant to get involved, as it is that he doesn’t want Ree to get involved. Jessup had only disappeared a couple of weeks prior, and Teardrop was biding his time. One gets the sense, from his initial conversation with Ree, that Teardrop had yet to come to the firm conclusion (though he may have suspected) that Jessup was dead, rather than somebody who had jumped bail, and was a “runner”. The main gist of what he said to Ree was that it was Jessup’s decision, and not really any of Ree’s business, if Jessup opted to jump bail (even at the cost of forfeiting the homestead and timber acres), rather tham go to prison.

At that point in the film, Teardrop did not know who specifically had killed Jessup, and quite possibly did not even know that Jessup was dead, let alone that he had snitched to Baskin. However, the filmgoer cannot know what knowledge Teardrop might have had at the time. And I’m OK with that. Real life has loose threads. Hollywood films do not.

Thank you for taking the time for this thoughtful writing; have you thought of publishing anything on OUATITW? And thank you for the personal tribute you extended to me.

Mark